To whom this may concern. I just want to bring up a point I feel is important, especially applicable during the summer.
This isn’t meant to target or hint at any hall particularly, but I feel that in general, especially here in Lakewood, we need to put a stronger emphasis on Tznius at wedding halls.
I recently attended several weddings, and it bothered me tremendously the lack of Tznius and mixing taking place at the entrances and lobbies.
I understand halls try their best and mark the men’s and women’s entrances, however, I feel more needs to be done, as Simcha goers are clearly not taking it seriously.
There’s no reason someone who is careful about Shmiras Einayim needs to be exposed to the mingling which greets him or her when entering the vicinity of the hall.
Especially during these summer months, when as is many dress questionably, it is more important to adhere to strict standards that are appropriate for a town like Lakewood.
And to all who feel a need to mingle, especially in the opposite gender’s section, please keep in mind this isn’t right, and is hurtful to those trying to keep a Frum Toradig lifestyle.
Thank you.
Tzvi M.
Lakewood.
(TLS welcomes your letters by submitting them to [email protected])
amen to that!
Tzvi m.
On your way to these weddings how many stop signs did you make a full stop at.
When you parked did you park between the lines or on a angle taking up 2 spots
We’re you on the phone during the drive to the wedding
Did you pay the right amount of taxes this year
Do you have a smart phone and or internet in your house
How about taking during davening
I could go on and on asking your questions like these, so before you decide to post something that OTHER people shouldn’t do. Make sure YOU are doing everything 100% legal and according to halacha
Maybe he does.
I imagine you would never ask your kid to do the right thing since you are in no way perfect
What you wrote above is the hashkafa of Oso Haish as expounded in his testament, “he who is without guilt shall cast the first stone” as opposed to the Holy Torah which says all Jews are responsible for one another, and we should surely chastise one another. Your type of thinking is the basis of western liberalism. No one is perfect so we must not criticize anyone. We must let society become more and more and more permissive while saying nothing. Chas V’Shalom and Rachmana Letzlan.
excellent
Mah Inyan Shmita Eitzal Har Sinai.
Please watch YOUR eyes and stop being busy with everyone else
Exactly his point!!!!! He is watching his eyes the only way the Torah said to. KEEP MEN AND LADYS SEPARATE
i have always wondered about this. if the same reception food was in the men’s section as in the women’s this would not be a problem
I think he is 100% correct! He is not talking about a family gathering their kids in the lobby, making sure everyone is there to leave the hall. He is talking about the people who come to the lobby just to schmooze. He is right about tznius being questionable both in dress and behavior. Either take it or leave it but don’t start responding that he probably does many other things wrong so why point this out? There is no such thing as a perfect person. Someone who is pointing something out for him and others to be careful with should be commended not ridiculed.
Hi Steve and baruch,
Reader is asking for help in shmiras ainayim not sure where all the anger is coming from. Possibly hit a raw nerve, does your wife dress appropriately? Is it maybe something your struggling with and cant stand someone is strong enough to ask for help. Just thinking……….
only makes sense as to why this would bother someone. the writer has a great point and is just trying to do right. must be by separating the men and woman more this will make it harder for those who want to mingle and that bothers steve and baruch
@ Steve pearl,
You are way off line, the writer is not saying that he’s perfect… All the writer is doing is brining out a point (and a good one) regarding tznius, which happens not to be a law, just a fundamental cornerstone of the religion which we practice….
P.S. @blnders I think u have a good point, the writer may have touched a wrong nerve!!
All what the author is doing is asking help for what he says in Birchas Hashachar that is davening… v’lo lidei nisayon.
I agree with him. He’s bringing up a point thats a real issue at halls that needs addressing. As religious Jews, we have an obligation to constantly strive for growth. Bringing up other topics that have nothing at all to do with what he’s talking about is missing the point.
To Newcomer:
The Answer is even if the same food was on the men side, that would not solve the problem.
The Reason?
It’s called Yetzer Hara!!
True.
However, it does make a difference- Newcomer has a point.
It also makes a difference whether the mechitzas go nearly to the end of the ballroom or if they barely go halfway to the wall.
Steve pearl: If I go through a stop sign can I then drive on shabbos? Obviously your comment makes no sense
If this issue has merit why isn’t it being raised en masses by Robbonim and Roshei Yeshivos. Why is it only coming to light on an internet page?
Lmaaseh the guy brings up a good point and it seems from the comments that we can all improve ourselves in various areas of yiddishkeit.
The same problem is that the mechutsa is not closed until the music stage. If there is a band or a choir they stand in the lady side!
While everyone has their own strong opinions on this and many other reader submitted articles on TLS, let’s try to speak respectfully to each other during this time, this applies especially during the Nine Days but also all year.
I’m sure we all have things we can work on and not everyone agrees on everything, but let’s speak to each other in a way that brings the Geula closer and not C”V push it farther away.
couldn’t agree more with the author. anyone who disagrees just enjoys sightseeing….
Thank you for your sincere letter, I share your concern.
It seems that some people are allergic to kedushas einayim topics & feel it should be the last thing to work on. Don’t be discouraged.
I kinda of agree with Steve.
I understand we can all improve on ourselves but if you are going post something on a blog, you better make sure you are doing things correct yourselves.
To all that have answered already. I’m sure you are all using kosher phones and or kosher Internet If not maybe you should think about get rid of them. Maybe using your non kosber phones to see things not nice is wrong also. So like you said. Shimras eynayim….
How dare you tell me what to do ! I can what I please and look where I want! This is a democracy, where does it says in the Torah that I need to follow…eh …er, um, never mind.
I agree we need to all ways try to be a better Yiddish. Especially with Elul comming soon.
It’s difficult to address because family members need to meet each other to keep in touch (“The babysitter needs us home”) or to wish the baalei Simcha Mazel Tov (uncles and grandparents on the other side of the mechitza). So the mechitza can’t be from edge to edge. Therefore, when women are all dressed up for a Simcha, it is upon them to remain refined in both dress and behavior, and limit their socializing at these spots to the bare minimum.
In very chassidic circles, men and ladies dance in separate buildings. This is not the hadrecha for most of us, and we are to keep the tznius in the way it is set up here in Lakewood.
I think that the writer is trying to blame his flaws on others. I agree that shmiras einayim is a major nesayon, but simchos are for family members to wish each other mazel tov and catch up. From all the mixed socializing I do at simchos I can say that it has never been inappropriate conversation. Rather, I’m talking to my wife, mother, sister, aunt… Most simchos in Lakewood are done appropriately while allowing the balei simcha and their family to see each other. If the writer cannot control themselves at simchos then I suggest they learn mussar and get guidance on how to control themselves.
“Especially during these summer months, when as is many dress questionably,”
Really?
I’m a little befuddled.
Until not that many years ago only chasidisher wedding halls had separate entrances. It’s only recently that all “frum” halls have separate entrances.
Secondly, if I’m not mistaken a mechitza is only required by davening and where there are women dancing.Beyond that is unrequired chumra to make you feel extra “frum”.
Actually most chit chat that I’ve seen take place across the mechitza is just usually husband/wife or siblings, Aunts, Uncles etc just close family & friends “vinching un” each other a Mazel Tov.
@author , I’m with you.
I must say, you should’ve waited until after tisha baav to post this, as there won’t be any weddings for a bit.
@steve pearl, I’m also with you, but not at all in regard to your comment on this post.
agree totally with author. there is a hall that has a mechitzah at the entrance and that is how they all should be. there is one hall that doesn’t and i always feel uncomfortable walking thru the lobby with all the men there. there is no reason there can’t be a mechitzah there at the entrance. 100% correct. it is a lack of tznius.
to the letter writer: please call them and request a mechitzah at the entrance.
when someone chooses to go the other side of the mechitzah to talk to someone that is their choice, but for the lobby to be open with everyone milling around there, that is wrong.
why must you refer to the ladies section as the “opposite gender” section? what is untznisudig about saying “ladies section”? i think it’s a bit over the top.
Huh? What do you mean- he’s speaking about both genders- men shouldn’t go into the ladies’ section and ladies shouldn’t go into the men’s section. Which part do you misunderstand?
@agreed every hall in lakewood has either some sort of lobby mechitzah or a separate ladies entrance, including the hall I believe you are referring to. If you feel uncomfortable entering the and walking through the lobby through the offical mens entrance then kindly use the designated ladies entrance. There is no need for phone calls and to make a tumult about a situation where the rectification is already in place.
I’ve never written a comment here before. In fact I’ve never read the comments before and honestly I’m shocked.
This article has me thinking..
In my experience of trying to live a better life, striving to be a better person every day than I was the day before, I have learned a few things..
* I am responsible for one person and that person is me. I am responsible for my thoughts and my actions.
* I am not responsible for other peoples actions. What other people do is none of my business.
* There is absolutely nothing in this world that I can control.
* Every single thing that I encounter is designed special for me by my loving Father in heaven.
* Every struggle brings an awareness, with that awareness comes the ability to change and if I change, I grow. If I don’t I’m human.
With that being said, maybe the person who wrote this article can take a good look at himself and see what he can change instead of what others can change. This is not to call anyone out or make anyone change it’s just a thought. I know when I’m really focused on other peoples flaws or how things outside of me need to change it is usually a distraction from having to really look at myself.
What I’m working on has nothing to do with others. The world doesn’t need to change for something I am struggling with. There are other options. Find a back door, close your eyes, don’t go, get there early, ask someone to call you when the coast is clear… the list can go on and on but then again it’s not my job to change you.
With that I will end this rant in the hope that maybe I’ve given someone something to think about. And that’s the gift of giving and spreading solutions. Not just throwing advice out to the web to ignite the flame of everyone’s opinions when whoever your really talking about doesn’t even care.